Blender could be better for new users without be worst for old users, and thats is the problem. That you must not to ignore 20-30% of the community only because you dont care, specially when it was not necessary.
And take note that because actually only 20-30% of user think that blender break the workflow is because the same people have complaining a lot about 2.8 and Alot of things have change ¿remember when facedot could be removed? When wireframe mode wasn’t exist? When 1,2,3,4… was for mode shorcuts? That was the original blende2.8 design… This forum exist because people complained, not because only give likes.
But you’re “out” before 2.8 is out. This is beta software. It seems like your main looming concern is exactly what the devs see as an issue with the tool system. There are initiatives to change these behaviors, but you’ve made your decision to leave before those things are finished.
Surely if you started at 2.45, you know that a good number of people felt betrayed and walked away from blender when 2.5 came out and shook things up and completely changed the interface. This is that happening again. Could you imagine sticking with blender 2.45 just because you didn’t like 2.5? From what I understand, 2.5 was barely usable for a lot of reasons when it first came out, but those issues were cleared up. It’s going to happen again.
2.79 still works beautifully until those changes come. I would argue that since I don’t have to change my workflow at all other than a couple of hours of finetuning my keymap, that 2.8 works beautifully too.
You know I’m not signing my life away to autodesk, right? I can always switch back if blender is “fixed”.
I’m not confident they will fix these things because I think these changes are a symptom of a different way of thinking about blender that no longer prioritizes hyper-efficiency. In the mean time I’m in the middle of an indie game that requires me to use max half the time anyway and I’m almost done with my current batch of freelance projects so if I’m going to make big changes this is the time to do it. Its going to take time to get my work flow in maya and max optimized so the sooner I start the better. Again, I can always re-download blender. I don’t plan on not monitoring development. I’ll know if they fix anything but for now I’ve got a new workflow to get used to and refine.
Also, as I said thats a great change. I think making it default breaks more than it fixes.
It was in some design documents, that we could have a different t-shelf for each workspace (a lot of people were happy with it, no users tell any against t-shelf), nobody inside development told nothing about remove t-shelf, and we received a lot of times the message that the interface won’t be touched and that we don’t need to worry about changes in the workflow and respecting user experience.
Now we don’t have t-shelf, the tools move to properties, menus change to pie menus, the behaviour of a lot of shortcuts have been changed, aesthetical changes that remove muscle memory,… all that things wasnt necessary to make blender better for new users.
And for example, the t-shelf is an arbitrary decision, when a simple few changes we could keep the t-shelf without any problem. But was decide to remove it only to break the workflow and all petitions about this were ignored. We only need to put the tool properties in sidebar, put sidebar at left of activetools and we will have the t-shelf back without any problem.
I guess I also asked for the ability to assign something other than the cursor to left click. So, don’t blame the devs. Blame the people who asked for these changes. Blame the people who didn’t speak up against us when we asked for them.
I agree that there are a lot of abandoned functions now that the keymap has been stripped down; things that you can only get to by searching for them now, which is bad.
perfect, now we have a mess of menus… menus that i cannot use with a tablet. Menus that dont give me access to a hundreds of things. And a sidebar that will be a mess because all addons will go to sidebar, the origin of that problems in the T-shelf. So we have lost the best part of the t-shelf and keep the worst part.
All in the right of the program, without any order or design.
Ten years of muscle memory in the left now need to change to the right because…potato.
2.8 is a series and in a beta phase, most of the complains that are in the video are still not 100% solved as far as i know, like the gizmos with selection tools, reshuffled hotkeys…etc so basically mostly about active tools, hotkeys…etc and notl actual functionality and how blender does stuff internally, which is in truth they are all still in development…if you are a professional then stick with 2.79 since it works well…because 2.80 won’t be as polished as 2.79 for a while and it’s not recommended to be use for any production yet.
You can do like the ostrich and look the other way and just see a bunch of novice users applauding each change of 2.8 or you can also be sensible and realistic and realize the damage that is being done to faithful blender users for years.
Considering that the loudest are the ones that aren’t happy with the changes. And those that are happy usually don’t participate in those discussions.
I see few people not happy here. Some of you are whining on almost every thread(doesn’t matter if its on the topic) here on the forum about the same thing. I would say that you’re the minority of the minority… statistic anomaly.
I find only those points valid, which the user can’t change them selves. The user should have the ability to change those things them self. As for not liking the defaults it’s just whining. Do it my way or no way waa.
As for those that state that they’ll switch to another software if blender won’t adopt to them, that is just childish.
I think, blender needs to change, to gain more people etc.
I hope, we will not lose the speed and efficiency in this change.
I really hope we will be able to edit the soft as much as possible, with templates for example.
Artist should learn coding, because, with addons, scripts etc, you can speedup a lot the workflow and as a pro, this is something you need.
So, I’m not really afraid about this 2.8, I will change all that I don’t like if it’s possible of course.
People always like to think that they are part of the majority, and that the majority is 99%. And that obviously whoever doesn’t think like him is in some way inferior or a child or a madman…
Of course, then come the surprises.
From my personal and close group of acquaintances what I see is quite different.
Two have already gone to Maya not to come back (they feel completely insulted, one even abandoned the group of blender we had), another is thinking seriously.
Three are very upset about the disappearance of the T-shelf.
The rest will continue with blender 2.8 but they are very upset with the usability changes because it has broken all their muscle memory and have some slow things. But anyway the workflow still been better than other programs.
Even the most positive of all tells me that using blender 2.8 is causing a pain in the ass.
Only one person I know, with whom I have little treatment, has not put any hiccups to 2.8.
Well, man, I don’t think it’s so popular with the users I know.
We can say that blender2.8 at the level of tools and utilities is certainly a huge improvement … but at the level of usability? What exactly have been the improvements for old users?
Column aligned to the right? It is widely criticized and has been asked by hundreds of people to change because it’s really hard to find something now.
Remove T-shelf? Very few people asked for this and very few people liked the change. And yet most of the community has to see the problems caused by this completely unnecessary paradigm shift.
Menus in the viewport? quite inferior to T-shelf. It reminds me of the menus of programs like Office, that people avoid to use.
Icons? They are more beautiful, yes, but it is well known that it costs a lot to change tab now, because it has eliminated the color and nuances that allow you to differentiate the icons. Nice but not very useful.
statusbar? we all know that the first thing we will do in blender2.8 when the final is to hide or ignore it. We pray that the statistics end in the viewport.
Topbar? The intentions were very good and is good for newbies, for others, except for sculpture or painting, is only a nuisance due to how it has been implemented in a fixed way without being able to place the user.
Pie-menus? They were before and were the demon according to some developers, now the user is forced to use them.
Toolbar? is no longer accessible by default, accepting that it is really useless.
Context menu? Good idea for people who want it, but why is it mandatory if you want to use the left click?
What are the real improvements in usability?
Left click of the mouse and some parts of the keymap (which was widely criticized)
New Popovers. They are an improvement, but do not add much, just organize otherwise how to access the options.
Active Tools, that everyone was delighted with them, before their implementation meant eliminating T-shelf.
Seriously, someone tell me what has improved blender usability because of those changes? Clearly it has improved a lot since the arrival of the left click, but the rest of the changes? I don’t see any real improvements either for new or old users.
I don’t know, maybe there is a master plan in the background where you can see the improvement that all this will bring us. For now I only see limited good ideas that there were before, and the main requests of users for years ignored (pineable windows, stackable editors, change some controls difficult to understand as the lists, …)
The changes the Blender team has made in 2.8 are exactly what was needed. It was, quite frankly, the worst UX, and I would not use it because of the UX.
I have made the switch to it professionally now because of their changes – having used and otherwise evaluated many, many others.
I feel, as others have said, that one adapts or can always tweak the interface, easily, to what you’re used to in the past.
@Zlyx Of course, you are a new user and the interface is focused on that type of users, no matter or take into consideration the users who have been using blender for years, that is the problem. You could have reached something in between without spoiling the fastest workflow I’ve ever seen. You’re enthusiasticwith your new toy, I understand, but they could have made blender better without breaking and changing everything. It is not normal that a user who has been using blender for 10 years, now can directly say in publicly that he has changed so much that he no longer knows how to use it and needs months or years to adapt to the radical changes he has undergone.